Please, help me understand

[u02mbr]

I've clearly made a mistake. I was caught without a ticket in a station. I didn't look into it online. I was waiting to be told how to pay by letter. I thought that I was following what they wanted, and entered in a plea of guilty, and now, I have been sent a letter by the court telling me to pay the fine and court costs.

Does this mean that I now have a criminal conviction/ criminal record?

It doesn't say anything about a conviction on the 'Results of the court case' letter.

 

[jfollows]

If you pleaded guilty to a Single Justice Procedure Notice then, yes, you now have a criminal conviction. However, if you are able to post the various letters you have received to date we may be able to be more precise in our evaluation.

 

[skyhigh]

Does this mean that I now have a criminal conviction/ criminal record?

Yes, you have been convicted of a criminal offence. It is unfortunate you didn't come for advice earlier as there is now very little that can be done if you entered a Guilty plea.

If you share copies of the letters you have received (with personal details obscured) we will be able to advise with what you've actually been convicted of.

 

[Fermiboson]

I've clearly made a mistake. I was caught without a ticket in a station. I didn't look into it online. I was waiting to be told how to pay by letter. I thought that I was following what they wanted, and entered in a plea of guilty, and now, I have been sent a letter by the court telling me to pay the fine and court costs.

Does this mean that I now have a criminal conviction/ criminal record?

It doesn't say anything about a conviction on the 'Results of the court case' letter.

Were you caught by TfL, GTR or GA/c2c? What correspondence did you receive?

If you received something with “Single Justice Procedure” or “Court Summons” or similar written on top, and you then ticked a box that said you plead guilty, then yes, you probably have been convicted either via SJP or in absentia. Railway/TfL byelaw convictions are usually immediately spent, so the conviction won’t show on DBS checks normally speaking, but if you are currently employed you want to as a matter of urgency check if the employment contract requires you to declare any convictions to the employer.

You want to share the copies of the letters you have received, suitably redacted, so we can advise on exactly what you have been convicted of and what the consequences precisely are.

TOCs generally offer out of court settlements before prosecuting if you’re cooperative, so unless it’s TfL who don’t do that, you must have missed something before it got to this stage.

 

[u02mbr]

Thank you.

It's TFL.

I'm clearly an idiot. These are the letters.

Before this, I received a Single Justice Procedure notice.

Even if it is spent, will it show up on an Enhanced DBS?

My wife is French. Will this impact me if we decided to move to France and I apply for a visa in a few years?

Is it too late for me to get a solicitor to try to avoid a criminal record?

 

[skyhigh]

TOCs generally offer out of court settlements before prosecuting if you’re cooperative, so unless it’s TfL who don’t do that, you must have missed something before it got to this stage.

While this is true, if a plea has been entered and a "result of court case" letter received then discussion about what what could have happened is largely theoretical as it's near impossible to get the conviction undone now.

Is it too late for me to get a solicitor to try to avoid a criminal record?

Yes, you are already convicted and have a criminal record.

 

[Fermiboson]

Thank you.

It's TFL.

I'm clearly an idiot. These are the letters.

Before this, I received a Single Justice Procedure notice.

Even if it is spent, will it show up on an Enhanced DBS?

My wife is French. Will this impact me if we decided to move to France and I apply for a visa in a few years?

Is it too late for me to get a solicitor to try to avoid a criminal record?

It will likely not show on enhanced DBS either, but it also might - I believe Unlock, a charity for rehabilitation, may have better advice on the matter. It is also a matter of differing opinion on this forum whether it is better to voluntarily disclose such offences to prospective employers anyways.

It may affect your visa applications. We are not legally allowed to give advice on this forum about immigration and visa matters, so please find a solicitor or other qualified professional in immigration law to answer specifically your concerns, but my surface level understanding is that foreign countries may not make a distinction between spent and unspent convictions.

A solicitor is not going to help matters at this point, unless there is some great procedural oversight the prosecutor and the court have both made which could be grounds for some sort of technical appeal, but that is both highly unlikely to work at all and not going to be worth it.

 

[Pushpit]

Even if it is spent, will it show up on an Enhanced DBS?

My wife is French. Will this impact me if we decided to move to France and I apply for a visa in a few years?

Is it too late for me to get a solicitor to try to avoid a criminal record?

You have a conviction for fare evasion, to which you pleaded guilty. Depending on your job it's unlikely to show on an Enhanced DBS, if it does, it will be there for up to 11 years and 1 day. It depends a bit on your precise area of work since there is a complex framework about disclosure here and it is role specific. But that's the wrong question to ask: if you are in an Enhanced DBS employment it would usually be the case that you have to declare convictions and cautions, failure to do so is more serious than this conviction. If you are in such an occupation now I suggest you talk to your trade union, or similar, to get specific information as to impacts. If you apply to a role that asks (legitimately) for convictions and cautions then they need to be listed in your application. This is because DBS comes through right at the end of the employment process, and jobs are usually offered subject to DBS and on the basis you told the truth in your job application. But it's not a serious crime here, and it's most unlikely to be fatal to your future plans.

You can really only overturn this conviction if you can come up with a very plausible reason, if you knew the SJ process was underway. A solicitor could help, but I would have thought it unlikely unless there is some other factor not so far mentioned.

 

[Titfield]

Doubtless you will be distressed to read that you have been convicted and have a criminal record.

However whilst this may seem life changing it rarely is.

Convictions for minor railway ticketing offences are at the lower end of the scale of convictions.

It may appear on an enhanced DBS check (opinions on the forum vary as to if, when and for how long convictions stay on a check).

Actions for you to take:

1. If you have not already done so pay the fine and associated costs immediately. This is to prevent matters escalating.

2. Check your contract of employment to see if you are required to declare any conviction to your employer.

3. Are you in a regulated profession or occupation which requires you to declare convictions?

4. If the answer to (3) and / or (4) is YES are you a member of a trade union TU or professional association PA who can give you advice as to how to declare your conviction to your employer and regulator?

5. If the answer to (4) is yes contact them immediately. Some regulators require convictions to be disclosed within a very short period of time so you must make sure you comply with the deadline hence getting TU or PA advice immediately is essential. Failure to declare is almost always seen by a regulator as an aggravating factor and can be the "tipping point" between the Regulator issuing a warning or taking more drastic action (ie issuing strike off or suspension proceedings).

6. Do not worry about the VISA issue at this time as it is not a live concern. Take professional advice at the appropriate time. NB @Fermiboson point that visa and immigration advice can only be given by a qualified specialist.

7. Finally TfL nearly always take ticketing matters to court (rather than offering out of court settlements ) so it is unlikely that you would have avoided the court summons even if you had taken advice from a solicitor.

 

[island]

Even if it is spent, will it show up on an Enhanced DBS?

It can, if the officer handling the DBS check considers that it is relevant to the role applied for.

My wife is French. Will this impact me if we decided to move to France and I apply for a visa in a few years?

You would need to take advice from a French immigration lawyer.

Is it too late for me to get a solicitor to try to avoid a criminal record?

The solicitor would need to be extremely persuasive. There is a route called a section 142 application which allows the magistrates court to "turn back time" even from a conviction after a guilty plea. But you or your solicitor would need to convince the court that it is in the interests of justice to do so, and convince TfL to drop the case. This would be amongst the steepest of uphill struggles.

Regardless, you'll need to pay the £612.70. There should have been instructions on how to pay included with the letter from the court. If you don't, bailiffs can be sent to seize goods from your property, your car can be clamped, deductions can be made from your wages, or you can even be nicked. In the event a section 142 application succeeded, this would be paid back.

If you are not in a position to pay this in one go, you need to contact the court's fines office who will usually be able to give you an instalment arrangement over 6-12 months.

Railway/TfL byelaw convictions are usually immediately spent

This isn't correct. They are spent after a year if punished by a fine. They are non-recordable, so won't ordinarily appear on basic or standard DBS checks.

 

[Haywain]

NB @Fermiboson point that visa and immigration advice can only be given by a qualified specialist.

I thought that was about advice on immigration and obtaining a visa to be in the UK, not on visas for other countries.

 

[SussexMan]

I thought that was about advice on immigration and obtaining a visa to be in the UK, not on visas for other countries.

My wife is French. Will this impact me if we decided to move to France and I apply for a visa in a few years?

It's about implications of moving to France.

 

[Titfield]

I thought that was about advice on immigration and obtaining a visa to be in the UK, not on visas for other countries.

Well yes but I rather think for something as important as that I would want to get advice from someone qualified and expert in French Law.

The point is that convictions are serious matters and can have adverse impacts. We know that having a conviction in the UK can cause significant issues in getting even a tourist visa for USA and IIRC for Australia.

 

[island]

I thought that was about advice on immigration and obtaining a visa to be in the UK, not on visas for other countries.

You are correct. The legal restrictions in Part V of the Immigration and Asylum Act 1999 that limit who may give immigration advice only apply to advice given in the course of business and in relation to the United Kingdom. That Act does not prevent us from giving advice on visas for France, but I will not personally do so because I have no knowledge on the subject, and I think the same applies to most members here.

 

[u02mbr]

Thank you so very much for the replies. It has really helped me understand the situation.

I'm feeling pretty stupid for not looking into it to prevent it going so far.

But knowing where it stands removes the imagination running wild and the panic.

@Titfield, I appreciated everyone's reply, but the tone of yours really helped me just calm down and move on.

My work just does a basic DBS and the employee handbook doesn't ask for notification. I'll dig out the contract just to be sure. I'll pay the amount demanded straight away. It's good to know what issues may arise if I apply somewhere else.

 

[Titfield]

Thank you so very much for the replies. It has really helped me understand the situation.

I'm feeling pretty stupid for not looking into it to prevent it going so far.

But knowing where it stands removes the imagination running wild and the panic.

@Titfield, I appreciated everyone's reply, but the tone of yours really helped me just calm down and move on.

My work just does a basic DBS and the employee handbook doesn't ask for notification. I'll dig out the contract just to be sure. I'll pay the amount demanded straight away. It's good to know what issues may arise if I apply somewhere else.

You are welcome.

It is easy for me to say relax, dont worry but please do try and relax.

You can get this resolved and you will be able to get on with your life.

 

[martinchapman8]

Make sure that you pay your fine within the time frame the court allows.

It is important you engage with the court regularly around your financial means.

Until it’s paid off, The court have the power to remit a fine if the amount does not reflect income ect. You can tell the court your circumstances by filling in form MC100 and sending it to your local Magistrates court.
A link is here.

Form MC100: Make sure you can pay your fine

Form MC100: Make sure you can pay your fine. This form is available in other languages.

www.gov.uk

You can even ask for it to come out of benefits if you are not good with money.

Do not let it get out of hand, I know of defaulters i’ve arrested and imprisoned for a £10 fine.